_eka_

Don't use this excuse

12 posts in this topic

19 hours ago, Kelvin Tran said:

This happens with all cloud services releases; it gets flaky.

You can't anticipate what will happen with cloud services. One minute, you could be barely processing any information and another minute, processing so much information you could practically use a dedicated AWS server.

The point is, cloud services are always inconsistent no matter what company you are referring to when they are first released. There needs to be time to refine the resource usage and to mitigate the sudden influx of new cloud users. Once most users are on Synergy 2 and there is no longer a sudden influx of users and a wide inconsistency between usages, Symless can go and refine their server configuration.

Kevin, Hi.

Please don't use this excuse for a stable release, that was for the beta period, I get really upset when there are excuses for bad planning, you can anticipate the number of connected machines due to that its a pay product.

"You have results or excuses, not both."

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Just now, _eka_ said:

Kevin, Hi.

Please don't use this excuse for a stable release, that was for the beta period, I get really upset when there are excuses for bad planning, you can anticipate the number of connected machines due to that its a pay product.

"You have results or excuses, not both."

If you think I am in any way defending Symless, please understand; just because I am a moderator does not mean this. I wholeheartedly agree with you on this.

However, there has to be a gap for reality here. Whilst I am not defending Symless, I am stating the truth in that most companies, even in a stable release, do not get cloud configuration right. Betas do not show you an accurate representation of cloud resource usage. Not even an RC. Only a stable release can truly do that. What do you mean you can anticipate the number of connected machines due to the fact that it's a paid product? What does payment have anything to do with this? Just because you can see how many people have paid doesn't mean you can anticipate how many machines. A set up may have 3 machines, or 15 machines. Just because someone pays doesn't mean that they'll use it. Whilst there is a minimum standard that is to be set and reached even on their first release, do you expect it to be perfect when it was just released? Symless hasn't even been given the chance to go back and audit the servers and implement solutions.

Do I agree an offline mode should be added? Yes. Do I agree that this is unacceptable? Wholeheartedly, hell yes.

Do I still give them a chance to right their wrongs here? Yes.

If you don't like it, email [email protected] for a refund. That's all I have to say.

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19 minutes ago, Kelvin Tran said:

If you think I am in any way defending Symless, please understand; just because I am a moderator does not mean this. I wholeheartedly agree with you on this.

However, there has to be a gap for reality here. Whilst I am not defending Symless, I am stating the truth in that most companies, even in a stable release, do not get cloud configuration right. Betas do not show you an accurate representation of cloud resource usage. Not even an RC. Only a stable release can truly do that. What do you mean you can anticipate the number of connected machines due to the fact that it's a paid product? What does payment have anything to do with this? Just because you can see how many people have paid doesn't mean you can anticipate how many machines. A set up may have 3 machines, or 15 machines. Just because someone pays doesn't mean that they'll use it. Whilst there is a minimum standard that is to be set and reached even on their first release, do you expect it to be perfect when it was just released? Symless hasn't even been given the chance to go back and audit the servers and implement solutions.

Do I agree an offline mode should be added? Yes. Do I agree that this is unacceptable? Wholeheartedly, hell yes.

Do I still give them a chance to right their wrongs here? Yes.

If you don't like it, email [email protected] for a refund. That's all I have to say.

Yeah, that's my problem with you, it's not the first time you present the card of "My way or the highway." with the email to refunds.

Remember that many of us paid twice, once for v1 and some time ago on early release beta or whatever was called v2 cause v1 was very buggy.

And yes you can anticipate, if you work in this industry, you must, or you don't remember all the problems with Diablo III release "Error 37 Problem"? If it happen to big companies what to talk with small ones. If you have 1000 buyers just anticipate for 10k connections and later you can downscale. But yeah the big C10K problem, welcome to the Software Industry... think twice before enabling Cloud Services.

You, as moderator, are here to help, not to send us home to ask for refunds, so please don't play that card again.

Do you know the frustration of not having access to computers without keyboard and mouse because Synergy can't connect at random? Well, that's the one I have now.

This refund card can backfire on the company, ask them if you are allowed to use it as often as you are doing.

Please be more of a helper than a bouncer.

just my 2 cents since being alpha tester for a paid product.

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Don't tell me how to do my god damn role.

I don't work for Symless, nor will I ever identify to do so.

I sent you to that email because you seem to be heavily unsatisfied with your usage of Synergy 2. It's better for me to send you that direction and hope you get your issue resolved directly with them than for me or any other community member to fight a fight that we will never win, nor will we try. 

We are specifically instructed to send people like you (with all due respect) to that email address. Don't tell me how to do my god damn role on these communities when I have already been specifically instructed by the company on how to do it. If you have a complaint about how "often" I'm saying to ask for a refund (which, to be honest, if you are unsatisfied about something that we can't fix, we are instructed to direct you to a refund service), then go ahead. You know what, just for the fun of it, @Nick Bolton, I wanna hear your insight on this. If I am wrong, I am happy to shut my mouth.

That's your problem with me? Really? I send you to email [email protected] because you transfer this issue over to Symless directly, and it is detrimental both to yourself and to the community for you to linger around here unsatisfied with no apparent road to recovery.

I was one of the people who paid twice. Don't talk to me like I don't know what it's like to pay $19 (well, $5 at the time) and $29 (that totals $34). For this software, that is not an insignificant price tag.

I've been trying to politely and professionally explain to you that Symless is going to need time to fix their cloud issues. You have continuously sprung back for no god damn reason at me. You have told me not to play the card of time. You have told me not to play the card of "giving them a chance to fix their cloud issues". You don't like the stable version of Synergy 2, yet, you won't accept a refund. I don't mind helping frustrated users, but when you go and blame me for apparently doing my role incorrectly, you have stepped way out of your line. You don't walk up to an employee of a company and say they're doing their job wrong, just like you don't in this case. Just because I'm not an employee, that doesn't change anything about this at all.

Do I know what it's like to have it not connect? Yes! I've had it not connect. For an entire half of an hour, I've had to mess around with killing services and general troubleshooting. And I've posted to @Nick Bolton, asking how the status of the fix is progressing. However, patience is key here. I don't want to defend Symless for these issues, but you are slowly but surely pushing me over to their side.

Symless is a small company. They don't have the resources to anticipate 10k users, and we haven't ruled out that this isn't just a bug with cloud services that they need time to fix. You are not giving them the one thing they need, and instead, take to community forums meant for people with actually-solvable issues and fire back at people attempting to explain to you that they will need time. If you are not willing to give them such time as is required, go ahead and get a refund. But do NOT fire at me for apparently doing my role incorrectly. I am doing it according to instruction, thank you very much.

I sent you to the best road that I think would work for you. You do not appear to be satisfied and receiving your money back might ease some of that. Maybe switch to another program, or wait until Synergy 2 bugs are sorted out before buying into it again. You have 30 days in order to ask for the return of the revenue you have provided them. But despite my efforts to help, you are the one to instantaneously fire that "oh, I'm supposed to be a helper". What am I supposed to do? The cloud services aren't mine, and you are way overestimating what I can do. Switch back to Synergy 1 if you are that unsatisfied and would prefer to attack me for sending you down a route I think would ensure the most satisfaction for you as possible. Do your own thing. Don't ask for help if all you're going to do is attack when you receive it.

"Just my 2 cents" as a moderator that is being attacked for giving help.

Edited by Kelvin Tran
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Kelvin, nobody is attacking you, but I do that when Nick sees this he helps you learn to constructively respond to customers concerns in future. Its uncomfortable to read and not a good look for synergy.

Edited by Jonno
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Just now, Jonno said:

Kelvin, nobody is attacking you, but I do that when Nick sees this he helps you learn to constructively respond to customers concerns in future. Its uncomfortable to read.

There's almost literally nothing I can do but tell you to go and directly talk to Symless.

You (I'm using "you" in general, not directing this towards you) tell me I'm not doing my role right, you tell me that I shouldn't be playing these cards and these excuses, and then one comes back and says no one's attacking me?

I am sending you down the best route I can, while being flatly honest. It's uncomfortable to see people told that if you aren't willing to accept help and that you aren't satisfied, that being told to email a refund address isn't an acceptable course of action? You try to satisfy everyone you can, and then the people that can't be as of the moment, you send them to a place where they can receive their investments back in the hopes that they use that investment on some other piece of software that works better for their flow, or save it and then invest later when the software is much more matured in a stable stage than it is now. I've been doing that.

Now I understand how you see it. You think I'm not trying to help, that I'm just sending you there because you're complaining. But if you've seen the explanations I've given him, my repeated requests to give Symless a chance to fix it and my reasoning, and he fires back, what do I say? What do I respond with? It is said that I need to help, but I've already helped to the best of my ability. All I can do now as an intermediary agent in a sense is to send you to another person that could help you and if not, process a return of your investment. That's that.

Our jobs here are to keep these forums under wraps and to keep it from exploding. If that involves sending some people to somewhere they can be more satisfied than arguing on a community board, then I will be more than happy to indulge upon it and provide you with that suggestion.

Consistently arguing here will not help improve his satisfaction of the product, nor can I do anything to fix the cloud issues and I doubt Symless can at this point either unless given time to perform the necessary steps of change management on a change to something as critical as their AWS infrastructural elements. So, I stand by my statement that the best route for him would be to get a refund and use his investment on another product that would work better for him. Symless' primary goal, and as an extension, mine's as well, is to ensure that customers are as satisfied as they can be. If they have issues that I can't help to solve, and it will be unlikely that a quick, non-temporary fix will be implemented even by a Synergy team member, I will send them to where I think they'd be most satisfied, the route of requesting a refund and again, waiting until Synergy is more stable as a product, or using that money to invest in another product that will serve their purpose and contribute to their productivity.

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"Eka, I'm sorry you're upset. We're doing our best. As I already suggested, the best option right now would be for you to contact our refund department. I'm not trying to blow you off, we're all working as hard as possible to rectify the situation and hope you'll stick with us especially since you've been a supporter for so long. Again, we want to make this right. KT out"

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18 minutes ago, Jonno said:

"Eka, I'm sorry you're upset. We're doing our best. As I already suggested, the best option right now would be for you to contact our refund department. I'm not trying to blow you off, we're all working as hard as possible to rectify the situation and hope you'll stick with us especially since you've been a supporter for so long. Again, we want to make this right. KT out"

Uh, okay.

End result is the same as giving you an email address for refunds; you're still suggesting, as Eka said, of the "my way or highway" card. I strongly disagree with him on that, but I also disagree that my method of doing it is unacceptable.

I said "If you don't like it, contact [email protected] for a refund". That's perfectly acceptable to say and sums up what you said in many less words. Plus, it's their refunds department, not ours. And it's not even a refunds department, it's a customer service branch.

But that's, admittedly, beyond the point. Point is, it is in no way different to say what you have said rather than point to a refunds address, saying that they email that address if they don't like the software. The representative will then go into detail about what you have just said. My role is to point them to the person that will say that, not give the whole thing myself.

I'm sorry you're upset? I think I said that, and if I didn't, I meant to. But even if not explicitly said, by my efforts in helping you, it should easily be implied. 

I don't hope he sticks with us. Sincerely, I don't. If it's not working for him, he shouldn't stay with Symless. You work to increase customer satisfaction, not to keep customers that are suffering in reach of your company. If there's another product that works, then go to that. You use what works for you, and companies adjust to that. He can use his investment that was returned to him on something else that will work for him, but I don't want anyone to stay that becomes less productive as a result of Synergy and are suffering.

Edited by Kelvin Tran
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On 11/10/2017 at 2:23 AM, _eka_ said:

Yeah, that's my problem with you

Welcome to the Troll Cave! :)

If you'd like a refund, please email: [email protected]

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